Ghost in the Shell Philosophy

[Belphy]

Ok so anyone willing to discuss the social and philosophic aspects of the same name anime/manga? How do you feel about Stand Alone Complex...etc.

[Herosbane]

...

Seriously?

[Lain]

I only have seen the movie "Ghost in the Shell"... or something.

[Deacon (AYC)]

U liked the fact that in the second movie, after they had been hacked, the argument popped up that what they are in may seem like the real thing, but infact it could just be another illusion created by the hacker. From there on, there is doubt in your mid if the events occuring are real or not.

[Belphy]

AYC by second movie you mean? Innocence or Solid State Society? Also I really do not remember those events are they from Laughing Man case? If so I haven't watched that series yet.

Lain there are plenty of philosophical metaphors in the first movie, you could use some of them.

So to seems I'll have to elaborate the most interesting aspect of Ghost in the Shell, at least to me - Stand Alone Complex.

Stand Alone Complex is a social phenomenon where unrelated, yet very similar actions of individuals create a seemingly concerted effort. Example given in the series is the Laughing Man case which was started by a individual perpetrator forming sort of a myth around himself as a very skilled hacker (which he wasn't; at least not to extent he was credited) . Later on the logo of Laughing Man was taken by numerous other "copycats" which build an extensive myth around him making him seem as sort of a super hacker (he was credited for being able to live hack anyone in the visible range and replace his face and face of other people with Laughing Man logo).
The "starting" Laughing Man eventually got fed up with this and left the scene leaving it to be exploited by numerous other individuals and organizations.

[Deacon (AYC)]

AYC by second movie you mean? Innocence or Solid State Society? Also I really do not remember those events are they from Laughing Man case? If so I haven't watched that series yet.

Lain there are plenty of philosophical metaphors in the first movie, you could use some of them.

So to seems I'll have to elaborate the most interesting aspect of Ghost in the Shell, at least to me - Stand Alone Complex.

Stand Alone Complex is a social phenomenon where unrelated, yet very similar actions of individuals create a seemingly concerted effort. Example given in the series is the Laughing Man case which was started by a individual perpetrator forming sort of a myth around himself as a very skilled hacker (which he wasn't; at least not to extent he was credited) . Later on the logo of Laughing Man was taken by numerous other "copycats" which build an extensive myth around him making him seem as sort of a super hacker (he was credited for being able to live hack anyone in the visible range and replace his face and face of other people with Laughing Man logo).
The "starting" Laughing Man eventually got fed up with this and left the scene leaving it to be exploited by numerous other individuals and organizations.

Innocence, we just only got Solid State in Australia yesterday. The events aren't from the Laughing Man case, the movie's are totally separate from the the TV series (except Solid State, which I think is a remake of 2nd G.I.G.).

The Laughing Man was about keeping your individuality, I haven't watched the series in about a year, probably should, I got them lying around somewhere.

[Belphy]

Innocence is when they copy ghosts of little girl into gynoid robots, right? I have that show but I haven't watched due to it being on Japanese (I can't speak or understand Japanese apparently). Though I remember Togusa being a robot or something, that was pretty disturbing.

[Deacon (AYC)]

yeye, togusa is a robot in one of the false realities presented by the hacker Kim. In another reality, they get blown up by battleships. XD

[WatermelonMan]

Why are you guys taking anime seriously?

[Deacon (AYC)]

Why are you close to two years late on this fucktardo.

[WatermelonMan]

Wut d fuq d dates they lie it said it was from d 2009 I must have misread d letters. I am d sorry.

[Zeuter]

It's because of the spambot, it bumped up some old topics.

[Dr.Mellifluous]

But seriously, let's consider the effects of colonialism on indigenous cultures and the earliest forms of anthropology that justified the outrageously racist sentiments European empires engaged in during the Colonial period as revealed to us through Dragon Ball Z.

[Cassiel]

Although you're kidding, I left school largely because that's exactly the kind of shit work people are doing.

[Herosbane]

How do I stay smart outside of college, Cass?

[Dr.Mellifluous]

First of all, I resent the implication that I am not wholly and completely serious about everything I say in this forum. Secondly, you gotta done read some books. Right now I'm reading The Know-It-All, drifting aimlessly through some poetry from Charles Simic and combing the Complete Lyrics of Cole Porter for assistance in writing my musical, since I finished a draft of my book and am letting it stew for a bit before I re-tackle it.

Also, the Internet.

[Cassiel]

Simic? Dear god why?

[Dr.Mellifluous]

Because the nice man at the bookstore recommended it to me, and he was cute. I'm not a fan.

[bdnakathelakaflammab]

But seriously, let's consider the effects of colonialism on indigenous cultures and the earliest forms of anthropology that justified the outrageously racist sentiments European empires engaged in during the Colonial period as revealed to us through Dragon Ball Z.

I personally think that the early forms of anthropology are represented by the scanner used by Vegeta to measure the power level of Goku. Of course, the scanner showed a far different reality than what Vegeta wanted to believe. There is no way his power level could be OVER 9000. This is similar to the disbelief of the advanced culture of the native americans. Also, the other guy with Vegeta whose name I can't recall clearly emphasizes the racist attitudes of the Europeans. Despite proving and demonstrating their understanding of agriculture and hunting, the indians had to fight and die much like Goku.

The main failure of Dragon Ball Z to be applicable to European colonalism is the dragon balls themselves. The indians had no mythical power to save them from the biological toll of small pox. There was no eight balls to wish away bullets either. They also largely failed to band together to combat the European influence, like...Piccalo and Goku had to do to finally defeat Vegeta+Co.


Man, I am bored as shit on my lunch break. And I remember WAYYYY TOO MUCH of Dragon ball Z

[Qaenyin The Angelblade]

Since Lain was mentioned earlier in the thread, something a lot of people I've known to watch it are unaware of:

The writer of the series did so to cause an arguement between american and japanese audiences, because he considered americans too different in mindset to understand the message he was trying to get across in the same way.

Main reason I bring this up is his motivation for doing so was because he resented the fact that americans tend to dismiss anime(and animated media in general) being a medium for conveying complex ideas or philosophy.

I just found that ironic considering the guy who replied to this after the spambot bumped it replied "Why are you taking anime seriously?"

Since that sort of mindset is exactly why Lain was made.
Edit:
http://www.animejump.com/modules.php?op=modload&name=Sections&file=index&req=viewarticle&artid=32&page=1

Here's the interview if anyone is interested.

[Cassiel]

There's very little that's complex or philosophical about Lain. And I'm not just saying that because I fell asleep for part of it. It tries to be complex, it tries to be philosophical, but that's about as far as it gets.

[Herosbane]

Much like... ... ... JAPAN?!

[Cassiel]

Japan is awesome. Suicide Club is awesome. Lain just tries too hard.

[Herosbane]

I like plenty of things from Japan. My post was more a parody of anime than anything else.

[Qaenyin The Angelblade]

Japan is awesome. Suicide Club is awesome. Lain just tries too hard.

Which is kind of funny since that's actually what the guy was going for. He wasn't trying to get a deep message across, just obfuscate the message enough that 2 different countries would interpret it differently and argue about what the message was.