This actually scares me

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This actually scares me

Postby Dr.Mellifluous » Sun Apr 18, 2010 1:45 pm

National Center For Lesbian Rights wrote:Greene v. County of Sonoma et al.

Clay and his partner of 20 years, Harold, lived in California. Clay and Harold made diligent efforts to protect their legal rights, and had their legal paperwork in place—wills, powers of attorney, and medical directives, all naming each other. Harold was 88 years old and in frail medical condition, but still living at home with Clay, 77, who was in good health.

One evening, Harold fell down the front steps of their home and was taken to the hospital. Based on their medical directives alone, Clay should have been consulted in Harold’s care from the first moment. Tragically, county and health care workers instead refused to allow Clay to see Harold in the hospital. The county then ultimately went one step further by isolating the couple from each other, placing the men in separate nursing homes.

Ignoring Clay’s significant role in Harold’s life, the county continued to treat Harold like he had no family and went to court seeking the power to make financial decisions on his behalf. Outrageously, the county represented to the judge that Clay was merely Harold’s “roommate.” The court denied their efforts, but did grant the county limited access to one of Harold’s bank accounts to pay for his care.

What happened next is even more chilling: without authority, without determining the value of Clay and Harold’s possessions accumulated over the course of their 20 years together or making any effort to determine which items belonged to whom, the county took everything Harold and Clay owned and auctioned off all of their belongings. Adding further insult to grave injury, the county removed Clay from his home and confined him to a nursing home against his will. The county workers then terminated Clay and Harold's lease and surrendered the home they had shared for many years to the landlord.

Three months after he was hospitalized, Harold died in the nursing home. Because of the county’s actions, Clay missed the final months he should have had with his partner of 20 years. Compounding this tragedy, Clay has literally nothing left of the home he had shared with Harold or the life he was living up until the day that Harold fell, because he has been unable to recover any of his property. The only memento Clay has is a photo album that Harold painstakingly put together for Clay during the last three months of his life.

With the help of a dedicated and persistent court-appointed attorney, Anne Dennis of Santa Rosa, Clay was finally released from the nursing home. Ms. Dennis, along with Stephen O'Neill and Margaret Flynn of Tarkington, O'Neill, Barrack & Chong, now represent Clay in a lawsuit against the county, the auction company, and the nursing home, with technical assistance from NCLR. A trial date has been set for July 16, 2010 in the Superior Court for the County of Sonoma.


I really don't know what else to say, I'm just trying to do my part and spread this story far and wide across the Internet.
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Re: This actually scares me

Postby Myth » Sun Apr 18, 2010 2:11 pm

This is harrowing. My great uncle and his partner were together for forty years, and luckily enough had the foresight to be business partners, so when my uncle took ill with cancer, he signed everything over to Phil - Phil took over the lease, "bought out" the other half the company, etc etc. and luckily, my uncle had siblings who supported him and would have never cut him out of everything. And Phil, no biological relation of ours, when he died recently made sure to include all of us in his will, to grant us what George would have left us had he died alone.

But how effing stupid that same-sex couples have to jump through such ridiculous hoops.
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Re: This actually scares me

Postby TheRaven7 » Sun Apr 18, 2010 4:57 pm

Yet another example of how people screaming GAY RIGHTS ARE SPECIAL RIGHTS are retarded Palin-Americans.
Last edited by TheRaven7 on Sun Apr 18, 2010 4:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: This actually scares me

Postby Ensabahnur » Sun Apr 18, 2010 4:59 pm

Wow thats a fucked up story, thanks for posting it hadn't read that. It'll be interesting to follow it in the months to come.
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Re: This actually scares me

Postby WatermelonMan » Sun Apr 18, 2010 8:45 pm

Dr.Mellifluous wrote:I really don't know what else to say, I'm just trying to do my part and spread this story far and wide across the Internet.


This story made it to the front page of both reddit and digg, so gratz, word has just been spread.

http://slog.thestranger.com/slog/archiv ... -officials

that's the story that was linked
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Re: This actually scares me

Postby WatermelonMan » Wed Apr 21, 2010 10:41 pm

This makes it less scary:

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Re: This actually scares me

Postby -Y- » Thu Apr 22, 2010 4:58 am

WatermelonMan wrote:This makes it less scary:

Actually, it's doesn't. Either way either one of the sides is lying, or both are.
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Re: This actually scares me

Postby Dr.Mellifluous » Thu Apr 22, 2010 1:03 pm

-Y- wrote:
WatermelonMan wrote:This makes it less scary:

Actually, it's doesn't. Either way either one of the sides is lying, or both are.


You're right, but for the wrong reasons. That letter reeks of ass-covering.
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Re: This actually scares me

Postby -Y- » Thu Apr 22, 2010 1:51 pm

I don't know the guys involved or the context, so I'm in no position to judge. All I can say I hope the trial is fair and unbiased to both sides.
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Re: This actually scares me

Postby Gorbadoc » Tue Apr 27, 2010 6:29 am

Myers' argument relies on a double-standard for proof. To file criminal charges, the county would have required proof beyond a reasonable doubt of domestic abuse. Meanwhile, to interfere with the enforcement of contracts between Scull and Greene, it was enough that the county suspected domestic abuse.

Multiple standards are in no way bizarre. For example, a search warrant requires only probable cause, whereas a conviction requires proof beyond a reasonable doubt and due process. I'm not sure where contract meddling falls, though in cases where I've seen a court change a contract between private citizens, it was because the contract was unenforceable as written. For example, I've heard of long-term employment contracts being thrown out, on the basis that this constitutes a form of indentured servitude.

Based on what Melli posted, it looks like both men were deprived of property and denied the right to make private contracts. It looks like the county stepped in to play the part of Scull in a legal capacity. Acting as Scull's proxy, the county argued that it, which is to say he, had changed his mind about any contract granting visitation rights or power of attorney to Greene. It sounds like a coup; I take over a small country's government by force, and my first official act as the new lawmaker is to declare that my coup was legal.
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Re: This actually scares me

Postby -Y- » Tue Apr 27, 2010 12:47 pm

Unfortunately I haven't found much about the case (this was one of the rare top results that had no Skull in it):
http://www.akawilliam.com/were-gay-seni ... -were-gay/

While there seems to be previous charges of assault, the auction and sale of Clay's property does seem suspicious. I suspect this ain't discrimination as much as plain old greed and exploitations of lesbian/gay non-marital status (disclaimer: I'm not familiar with American law).
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Re: This actually scares me

Postby Dr.Mellifluous » Tue Apr 27, 2010 11:03 pm

A/S/L?
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Re: This actually scares me

Postby -Y- » Wed Apr 28, 2010 9:51 am

Dr.Mellifluous wrote:A/S/L?

F/M/H.
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Re: This actually scares me

Postby Herosbane » Thu Apr 29, 2010 1:29 pm

Try to stay objective, Melli.

I'm not sure about the case, but it seems plausible to me that under allegations of physical abuse actions were taken that could be misconstrued as overreaction. But, I've got no real idea. Auctioning off all their possessions seems really weird to me, but again, I've got no concept of how these things are "supposed" to go.
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Re: This actually scares me

Postby Dr.Mellifluous » Thu Apr 29, 2010 4:14 pm

I sincerely hope that remark was directed at my sidetrack rather than the actual content of the thread. BTW wtf does F/M/H mean?
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Re: This actually scares me

Postby -Y- » Thu Apr 29, 2010 4:44 pm

Dr.Mellifluous wrote:I sincerely hope that remark was directed at my sidetrack rather than the actual content of the thread. BTW wtf does F/M/H mean?

I presumed you meant Age/sex/location. This was one one of the many abbreviation that I got for A/S/L query and fitted the context most (chat). So I responded in a similar manner (Forgot/Male/Here).

What did you expect? An insult? Either way, you know how I felt.
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Re: This actually scares me

Postby Dr.Mellifluous » Thu Apr 29, 2010 7:49 pm

I did, I just never had seen that response before. Mostly, I was curious where you live, since you said you don't know much about American law. I didn't expect an insult, I expected an A/S/L.
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Re: This actually scares me

Postby Kaz » Thu Apr 29, 2010 10:17 pm

Not that I'm insensitive to the topic at hand, but given the internet's inclination to completely misrepresent law cases (see: the McD coffee lady) I'll need a lot more info to believe anyone involved.
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Re: This actually scares me

Postby -Y- » Fri Apr 30, 2010 2:55 am

Dr.Mellifluous wrote:I did, I just never had seen that response before. Mostly, I was curious where you live, since you said you don't know much about American law. I didn't expect an insult, I expected an A/S/L.

I got a vague abbreviation, I responded in a vaguer abbreviation. I'm 20-ish (I really don't know or care how old I am), I'm male and I currently on my way to Gornja Suvajla.

Also, why would it be notable that I don't know much about American law? I already said I'm not from America and secondly I'm not a lawyer or had much contacts with the law.
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Re: This actually scares me

Postby Dr.Mellifluous » Fri Apr 30, 2010 10:08 am

Okay, I'm done trying to communicate with you.
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Re: This actually scares me

Postby GraveI » Sat May 01, 2010 11:18 am

Kaz wrote:Not that I'm insensitive to the topic at hand, but given the internet's inclination to completely misrepresent law cases (see: the McD coffee lady) I'll need a lot more info to believe anyone involved.


What about the McD coffee lady?
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Re: This actually scares me

Postby Dr.Mellifluous » Sat May 01, 2010 11:28 am

Kaz wrote:Not that I'm insensitive to the topic at hand, but given the internet's inclination to completely misrepresent law cases (see: the McD coffee lady) I'll need a lot more info to believe anyone involved.


This isn't the Internet though, it's a legitimate Gay Lesbian legal organization. I don't understand why you'd need more information, this kind of shit happens in America. Elderly gays are fucked, because when they came out they typically lost their entire family. Elder abuse amongst gay elders is far more common than heterosexual elderly, and they have no one to advocate or protect them. This is not the first incident of its kind, and it's not even the most heinous. If you don't feel you know shit about the topic, then read up on it, because that response is bullshit. If you don't trust the Internet, then either trust me or go get your own fucking sources. And yes, I am pissed and mixed up in this topic, because this is the kind of shit MY LIFE deals with.
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Re: This actually scares me

Postby Cassiel » Sat May 01, 2010 5:57 pm

GraveI wrote:What about the McD coffee lady?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liebeck_v. ... ants#Facts
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Re: This actually scares me

Postby Kaz » Sat May 01, 2010 6:48 pm

Well Melli the letter from the DA makes it look like classic domestic violence. One of my aunts went through something very similar. They wouldn't let her husband see her at the hospital because he was abusive and he ran to the press and whoever would listen to him for sympathy. Later he fought in court to get all her estate.
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Re: This actually scares me

Postby theboogleman » Sun May 16, 2010 4:22 pm

Melli you might like/dislike this movie: 8: The Mormon Proposition

It's also good if anyone feels strongly about prop 8 and the whole gay rights thing. Or if you want to mormon bash.
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